Guancha: Brazil's economy has experienced a rather difficult decade in the 2010s, which has Led to rising domestic discontent and trouble. What do you think are the reasons behind this? How come Brazil overcome these challenges?
Cristovam Buarque: I think that the main reason why we’re in this situation with so rich a country is the lack of education, centuries without education for our people. The lack of education makes a country divided, socially divided. The main reason for the division of Brazil, we have to say Brazil is almost an Apartheid system, not racial apartheid as in South Africa since most of us are mixed; while there is some prejudice, some racism, but not racial apartheid.
But we do have a social apartheid, based on who has money, and who has no money. And having or not having money depends on having or not having education. And beside that, the lack of education is behind the fact that the politicians do not find a way to Brazil. We need education.
Beside that, we need better laws, to avoid corruption, and we need long term planning to our purpose. Brazil is very short term oriented. And this is a problem that we have to overcome.
Guancha: How would you overcome?
Cristovam Buarque: We have two strategies. In the long term, improved education is key. And in the short term, let's get together. Lula has been saying that to finish the Ukrainian war, we just have to put Putin and Zelensky on the same table. I think that in Brazil, he should do the same with the opposition, even the bad guys, sitting together to discuss, to talk and to find a middle way.
It will not to be Lula's way, Lula's party’s way, and I hope we will never have the Bolsonaro people in government again, but we have to talk. The answer to your question is talk, talk, talk, with modesty. No one knows exactly what to do. So, let's discuss. Let's having conversations, as Lula proposed between Putin and Zelensky.
Guancha: This sounds kind of similar to what China has been proposing based on traditional Chinese philosophy, of trying to find common ground and trying to come together, include all views and not just holding some as superior to others.